Talk:Allusions
Archived Talk Pages
Page Revamp?
I've put together a new Allusions page User:Kharzad_Ironfist/Projects/Allusions over the last couple weeks. I think the newly developed page has several advantages over the current implementation, but it probably needs a bit of work before it's ready to be copied over. The main advantage is that the new page is 43% as 'tall' as the current allusions page, while retaining as much information. It looks more like an article than the current wall of text that is currently used and has been unified to be in alphabetical order, it has links to articles supporting the allusion, and has simplified many explanations. Oh, and it has pictures, so it's a bit more interesting. In creating it, I've added a couple unlisted allusions and removed a few dozen that didn't meet the criteria applied to the other allusions in the list. I've listed a change log below. Of course, all of the additions and removals were my opinions of them, and be changed.
Overall, I think switching to a new page layout would be beneficial because the article would look more like an article, look more interesting, and be much easier to use. Kharzad Ironfist 03:31, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
List of changes:
Overall
- Reformatted the page to have content text in addition to the lists of allusions.
- Included pictures for every allusion.
- Organized headings to remove the other category.
- Made use of anchor tags instead of sections so the table of contents isn't as long.
- The title of each allusion is an internal link to the allusions page.
- Organized everything alphabetically by real-life allusion.
- Shortened each description of the allusions.
Added
- Gandalf - Gundralph, a mage in Noodle's Academy of Modern Magic might be named after Gandalf. This is supported by other spell teachers being named after fictional wizards.
- Additional support for the Labyrinth reference Didymus/Didimus and Lubo/Ludo
- Apocalypse Now - Mad Technomancer: "I love the smell of firebombs in the morning"
- Corona - Tavern owner Maria Corona (re-added, actually)
- A couple more James Bond references from existing sources
- Alatar - A wizard from Tolkien lore.
Removed (The italicized things are probably debatable, but probably need further information or support to be included, in my opinion)
- Ferumbras - While 1/3 of the name is the same, there is absolutely no other similarity and just a similar name with no other connections does not an allusion to an NPC make.
- Frodo's Sword - There's no connection between Sting and the bright sword, as is pretty much stated in the current description.
- Nargor - I couldn't find any online links to definitions for Nar and Gor, even on the LOTR wikia page.
- Bartholomew Roberts - There's no connection except he was nicknamed Black Bart (and there are other Black Barts, including real thieves) and there is an NPC named Black Bert.
- Mount Etna - The Ethno Coat isn't an allusion to Mount Etna simply because they have the same name root.
- Dune - Connecting Dune to the entire continent of Darama+rotworms is a bit of a stretch without a stronger connection than "they both have deserts and worms that live in those deserts."
- I, Robot - The in-game book I, Ghoul (and I, Vampire, though that isn't mentioned) aren't really 'clear allusions to I, Robot", if anything they're to I, Claudius, but in reality there are hundreds of things following this name format, so finding a clear allusion is difficult.
- Behemoth - Including the creature isn't an allusion.
- Vampires/Bats/Garlic - Including them doesn't make them allusions.
- Roc Feather - As above, calling a roc feather and allusion to a roc is ridiculous, at best.
- Medusa - same as above. Medusa and gorgon are basically synonymous, colloquially.
- Efreet - As above.
- Marid - As above.
- Monkey Island 1 - There are lots of things that follow the "I did x and all I got is y" pattern, so I'm not sure this is a valid allusion.
- La Vendedora De Rosas - Huh? There's not even an understandable explanation, let alone a valid reason for a connection to an old, obscure Colombian film.
- Gone With The Wind - Simply having an NPC say this doesn't make it an allusion.
- Metalocalypse - Jean Pierre is not most likely a reference to some character from some manga series.
- Topsy-Turvy - Whoever added this should be blocked from editing TibiaWiki.
- Iron Maiden - 1) Having part of a quote by banshees include part of a name from a song is a bit of a stretch. 2) The Blood Brothers quest is not an allusion to a song called Blood Brothers.
- Rage Against the Machine - The Killing In the name of… quest is actually probably not an allusion to the Song "Killing in the name of…" as it's not that uncommon a phrase.
- Dead is the new alive - Just because it's the name of a song doesn't necessarily make it an allusion to a song as the phrase has been used before the song was released, in other sources.
- Relic Hunter - The rank of Relic Hunter is a very iffy connection to a show called Relic Hunter as the other ranks don't resemble anything.
- Hellsing - Vampire and demon hunters have always dressed this way since literature about them was written over 100 years ago, not just in some anime manga.
- Star Trek -> Captain Kurt - Kurt and Kirk… I fail to see a connection here. Their characters have nothing in common and their names are only 1/2 the same.
- Castlevania - Not being familiar with the series, I can't say for certain that Julius isn't a reference to Julius from the series, but I can certainly say that beholders are not references to some peeping eyes from the game, so that invalidates the entire claim in my eyes. The Castlemania achievement adds some credence, but I'm not sure how it's related to NPC Julius.
- Ceiron the Elf - The connection from a fur head add-on given by an elf to a centaur named Chiron is pretty weak.
- Chrono Trigger - Who adds this stuff, anyway? This is clearly rubbish.
- The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe - I've only seen this occur at the Amazon Camp and in conjunction with other containers (The Lion, the Witch, and the Crate, I don't really think so)… If re-added it should probably include a thumbnail to a picture in which all 3 elements are present as wardrobes occur more frequently with amazons than witches alone
- Star Trek -> Qapla' Considering nothing else about minotaurs suggests any sort of relation, I don't think this is strong enough to include.
- Yakchal - Not an allusion. See: definition of allusion.
- Gree Dee - Same as above.
- Klaus Badelt - I fail to see a valid link between a pirate named Klaus and a composer named Klaus Badelt without any other connections.
- It is a Good Day to Die - There are over 20 uses of the phrase on the wikipedia page… to be added it needs to be put into perspective and attributed to one of them
- Munster - Not an Illusion.
Kharzad Ironfist 03:31, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
About Chrono Trigger: I added the piano reference, don't remember if I put in Melchior or if it was someone else. Might have been me, too. Also, there's Lavos armor, which may be a reference to the creature from that game. Oh, and in the Castlevania section that's not a "may be", it's an "is". Friend of mine, a quite devoted fan of the series, might I add, had it confirmed by a CM on the test server for that update. Can't present any proof of that, though. Vhazhiphor 09:47, October 13, 2010 (UTC)
Golem in the Gears
Does anyone think the achievement Golem in the Gears is any relation to the Piers Anthony novel of the same name. I did a bit of Googling and could find absolutely no other use of the term except his book. The problem is that the achievement has very little in common with any part of the book. Kharzad Ironfist 19:24, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
Zion or perhaps this one would be more suited and Zzaion, I'd say are allusions but I cannot exactly find the appropriate place for it on the page, Film and Television or Places, Organizations, and Constructs? Also there could be a reference to Snow White, there is an area in Tibia (close to here, near to the Old Iron for A Father's Burden Quest), where there are 7 dwarf guards, a witch and a female sleeping in a bed or cot. I currently do not have a picture/map for this because I haven't been there myself and cannot remember where it is, but I can assure that it exists and will find a picture if necessary. Beejay 16:08, August 14, 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I found that snow white room too, when looking for the old iron during last test server, isn't it here?
Snow White is already on the page under "literature", but you're correct that it is missing a picture. Do you think it would fit better under film? I'm not certain of the differences between the original fairy tale and the Disney film. I do not think that listing Zzaion as an allusion to Zion of the Matrix would be correct. After all, the one in the Matrix is an allusion to the Biblical city. I'd say listing it as an allusion to the "real life" Zion is more appropriate. --Kharzad Ironfist 17:33, August 14, 2010 (UTC)
Allusions to Diablo
Doesnt anyone but me think that the Dreaded Cleaver 
is an allusion to one of the most famous Boss Monsters / Unique Weapons of the Diablo games series? This allusion imho is repeated in the Butcher's Axe 
.
Another allusion might be the Tibian Defiler 
which looks like a slime'n'jelly monster. Anyone who has been to The Hive in Diablo 1 Hellfire expansion (a slimy organic underground cave) and knows that the Hive's Boss Monster is called Defiler might see a parallel here, too.
Barathorn 08:35, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
I think it may just be coincidence, but Troll Champions saying "Wazz up" may be an allusion to scary movie 1, when they start doing this.
Camioneto 23:01, October 28, 2010 (UTC)
Yalahar guards and comics characters
Hey, guys, don't know if you already noticed that. I was checking Yalahar page and then I realized that the name of the guards of the gates are names from comics characters.
Barry (between Magician and Suken Quarters) - From Barry Allen, a.k.a. The Flash.
Bruce (between Alchemist and Cemetery Quarters) - From Bruce Wayne, a.k.a. The Batman or Bruce Banner, a.k.a. Hulk.
Hal (between Arena and Zoo and Alchemist Quarters) - From Hal Jordan, a.k.a. Green Lantern.
Oliver (between Factory and Sunken Quarters) - From Oliver Queen, a.k.a. Green Arrow.
Peter (between Factory and Trade Quarters) - From Peter Parker, a.k.a. The Spiderman.
Reed (between Cemetery and Magician Quarters) - From Reed Richards, a.k.a. Mister Fantastic (of the Fantastic Four)
Tony (between Arena and Zoo and Foreigner Quartets) - From Tony Stark, a.k.a The Iron Man.
So, that's it. I don't know how most of things here work, but I think it should be added in the Allusions page.
And sorry for any mistakes, English isn't my first language.
Ralvarez 17:23, December 9, 2011 (UTC)
Island of Destiny
I have a question, could the Island of Destiny be a reference to Destiny Island from Kingdom hearts??
In KH, Destiny Island is like the place where you start the game (kinda like in tibia it's like the place you go after rook where you get a vocation and stuff).
Camioneto 03:52, January 23, 2012 (UTC)
I suppose it is possible, but i do not think so. Before the Island of Destiny was created a player would talk to The Oracle who asked if you were "prepared to face your destiny" then you would get your vocation and be sent to main land. The Oracle still asks this question but now you are sent to the Island of Destiny so it seemed more of a logical name then a reference to anything else.
I would not object to it being added if it said that it may an allusion since there is some doubt. --DM ><((°> Contribs <°))>< talk to me 04:13, January 23, 2012 (UTC)
Isle of Evil Allusions
The whole isle of evil are just allusions. I added the allusions of Hulk (Monstor) and Mephistopheles (Mephiles), but i cant figure the allusion of the boss Boogey. Any idea of who could be? It's the only one left.
» Sez6 ~ Talk « 04:55, July 28, 2012 (UTC)
It's an allusion to the boogeyman. Quoted from wikipedia:
"A bogeyman (also spelled bogieman, boogeyman or boogieman) is an amorphous imaginary being used by adults to frighten children into compliant behaviour."
This seems right, especially if you're taking Boogey's sounds in consideration:
"Since you didn't eat your spinach Bogey comes to get you!"; "Too bad you did not eat your lunch, now I have to punish you!"; "Even if you beat me, I'll hide in your closet until you one day drop your guard!"; "You better had believe in me!"; "I'll take you into the darkness ... forever!".
Wouterboy (talk) 13:40, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
Strictly speaking, this is not an allusion. There's no reference to a literary bogeyman, but rather the actual inclusion of a bogeyman. --Kharzad Ironfist 19:29, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
Twig's Beverage Inc
In the Thais Wasp Dungeon (second level underground, IIRC) there are Twigs on a pool of beer. Is it an allusion to Twig's Beverage Inc or just coincidence? Thascius (talk) 13:03, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
First, that would not make an allusion. Second, given Cip's location and the distribution area of "Twig's Beverage", I would imagine that that would be a tad unlikely. --Kharzad Ironfist 19:29, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
About Munster and the achievement "Castlemania"
I do think Munster is a sort of an allusion, as Rats/Mice like Cheese and drop it. this one is named after the cheese type : Muenster cheese (named after a german city)
also the achievement castlemania is for marking areas around and in the vengoth castle with a map which is given to you by Julius, also his outfit is pretty similar to the game character, in color and style. so i believe it is an allusion to the video game.
~ Vapaus (talk) 16:57, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
Julius and the Castlemania achievement are already mentioned on the page. Munster isn't an allusion because allusions, by definition, are references to literary works. While we have stretched that to include some famous/historical people, you cannot be an allusion to an object or a city. While the origins of Munster's name are obviously clear, it is not an allusion. Similarly, the horse selling NPCs are named after breeds of horses, but they aren't allusions. --Kharzad Ironfist 19:29, September 8, 2012 (UTC)
alright man, thanks. i was simply refering to your notes on this talk page, you can see i wasn't sure about these things from my reply. anyway, thanks for putting so much into it :)
~ Vapaus (talk) 04:01, September 9, 2012 (UTC)
Yakhchal
Yakchal means "ice pit" in persian [1] where the creature does come out of a similar type of place
~ Vapaus (talk) 19:19, October 24, 2012 (UTC)
skyrim allusion
There is a direct reference to Skyrim in the Goblin merchant's task "guard"
He asks for you to use a bow and hit adventurers to turn them into guards. When they get hit they exclaim "argh my knee" (Arrow to the knee)
Muhad's (the nomad NPC leader in Darama desert) full name "Muhad ib Lisan al-Gaib", a reference to the Dune Universe (here). Perhaps it could be added to the Wiki. I don't know how. This page is very confusing.
Aveleira (talk) 06:06, June 30, 2014 (UTC)Aveleira
Elder Scrolls Allusion
Svargrond seems to be an allusion to Sovngarde from Elder Scrolls, which is a snowy/icy city where the nords live (not to mention dragons). Druid or Something (talk) 15:07, June 30, 2014 (UTC)Druid or Something
Svargrond was introduced in 2007 and Skyrim in 2011 so i do not think so. --DM ><((°> Contribs <°))>< talk to me 01:18, July 1, 2014 (UTC)
It's true that Sovngarde was implemented with Skyrim, but maybe this area already existed longer in the Elder Scrolls lore? I, however, am no expert on this, so maybe someone could enlighten us? -- Wouterboy (talk) 21:22, July 2, 2014 (UTC)
Corym - Redwall Corim
An allusion was added that the Corym race is an allusion the Corim from Redwall, but this named was determined in a contest and the submitter, in this post, based the name on an extinct rat species, "Coryphomys". I am inclined to remove this since the intention was not an allusion (at least not obvious for the player) but i am wondering if this could still qualify on some other basis. Unrelated i am wondering if there are other undocumented Redwall allusions. --DM ><((°> Contribs <°))>< talk to me 01:18, July 1, 2014 (UTC)
If it's not intended, it should be removed. I assume the name Corim also came from Coryphomys, anyhow. -- Wouterboy (talk) 21:22, July 2, 2014 (UTC)
Boston Tea Party
There is a mission in the new Oramond Quest called the Rathleton Turnip Party, which involves stealing crates of turnips and throwing them into the water. This is obviously a reference to the Boston Tea Party, but it doesn't seem like there is a section on this page that fits this reference. Any thoughts on what to do? The legendary orp (talk) 05:49, July 13, 2014 (UTC)
That's not an allusion. It isn't (as Kharzad stated further up on this page) "because allusions, by definition, are references to literary works. While we have stretched that to include some famous/historical people, you cannot be an allusion to an object or a city. While the origins (...) are obviously clear, it is not an allusion. Similarly, the horse selling NPCs are named after breeds of horses, but they aren't allusions." -- Wouterboy (talk) 11:34, July 13, 2014 (UTC)
The Drowned Sea God
Could the achievement "The Drowned Sea God" be a reference to "The Drowned God" from "A song of Ice and Fire"? The first appearance of the Drowned God was in 1998, in Clash of Kings... And I don't think it's unlikely that CipSoft producers knew A Song of Ice and Fire before the TV show Game of Thrones.